I didn't read "Wilcox extension" in this article so I guess things are as fine as they were a week ago. Also, I do not recommend reading "Wilcox extension" out loud.
I know most Cal fans want Wilcox gone and I won't defend him (like I did for a certain other coach...), but this would've been a truly terrible time for him to leave.
It would've opened up the transfer portal and we'd be gutted without an opportunity to make things up with other transfers. And not to mention that puts players like Ott at risk of transferring as well.
Best to get one season in the ACC and then if we get rid of Wilcox to do it early before the portal and early signing day closes.
By what evidence do you come up with the statement that "most" Cal fans want Wilcox gone? Most fans with a knowledge of football intricacies don't necessarily agree with you. There are many other factors that make a team a winner other than the head coach and Cal has troubles in a lot of areas other than the coaching of their teams. Campus administration, AD's, the city of Berkeley, recruiting money (including (NIL), and the constant turnover of assistant coaches and staff.
Seriously. Excuse after excuse…it does grow rather tiresome, really.
It’s not the Cal administration’s fault that in his first 6 seasons, Justin Wilcox was unable to produce a competent backup QB that could even consistently complete a pass. And the turnover in staff because of mistakes made when you hire your buddies is not the responsibility of the guy making those hires.
Does being more aware of the nuances of football allow one to see that being 21-37 in conference really has nothing to do with the Head Coach? Who knew.
I mean to be fair - quite a few folks (myself included) have been HIGHLY critical of Wilcox and would have welcomed an alternative if one could be found. I think when one says "most fans with a knowledge of football intricacies..." I think you are basically counting MOST casual and even passionate fans out. Wilcox has had quite a few disappointing aspects to his tenure especially with respect to offensive capability so it's reasonable to consider his replacement. I also agree with royrules22 regarding what a difficult position Cal would be in if Wilcox HAD left for another job.
Wow that is not the sentence that I thought would come under fire. I don't know most fans. I only the fans I know and what I read on WFC or other social media. There's a sentiment of frustration at Wilcox and a wish he would go to AZ or something. I merely expressed that if he were to leave now it would be bad.
And yes I made a generalization instead of writing a scientific analysis of who actually wanted him gone. I did that so I can get to what I actually wanted to say. Do you have any other criticism for my casual comment?
And please defend your statement of "most fans with a knowledge of football intricacies" don't want him gone. I have counters so how can you say "most fans"? Or were you also making a simplification as I did?
Just chiming in to say that as much as the internet likes to espouse "technically correct is the best kind of correct", it really isn't the case. You need to be able to make social judgements as to when minor contesting of world usage is worth anything.
Meh from this perspective, there's never a good time for a coaching change. The best time would have been years ago, the second best time is right now. Delaying the inevitable won't help - hell this is a great time where expectations are low, new conference foes won't know much about us, etc. Not sure what will be better next year outside of yet another year of unrealized potential and mediocrity (if we're lucky).
Yeah a coaching change right now would be a disaster. We need all the stability we can get heading into a new conference. We can work on an upgrade later.
It's too late now, but I would have taken a Brennan for Wilcox trade in a heartbeat. You want to talk lousy institutional support for football? Then go visit San Jose State. Wilcox might be the luckiest man in college football, having parlayed the Oregon hiring hoax into a bloated $4.75 million salary and being able to crow about reaching a bowl game in 2023 based on a pure fluke. That fluke being Ethan Garbers getting knocked out in the first five minutes of the UCLA game. This is a good hire for Arizona, and they were decisive in making it without giving nary a thought to Wilcox.
Without wanting to defend JW, calling the bowl game a fluke is disingenuous. The team finished off the season on a great 3win streak and earned it.
Take away some abysmal refereeing "flukes" earlier this season and it doesn't even come down to that. We had a scoop and score taken off the board against Auburn for fuck sake lol.
I was dancing on the ceiling when Cal beat UCLA, but I still maintain the win was a fluke. And maybe Cal's belly flop in the Independence Bowl proves the point. UCLA was a totally different team when Garbers played as shown the week before when the Bruins decimated USC, and in their bowl game when he came in during the second half and led them to a come from behind win over Boise State. Remember Dave Barr in 1993? Cal was 8-0 in games he played in and finished, and a dismal 0-4 in games he sat out due to injury. Same thing.
We have our own share of "What if Garbers wasn't injured?", I'm not going to lose sleep over UCLA's. Still, I get your point. I'm just pointing out it goes both ways. And, generally, flukes seem to go against us, so it just doesn't feel right to qualify our wins the one time it goes in our favor.
Also, it would be more typiCAL fashion if their backup came in and lit us up. So there's something to be said about our defense making it a rough day for their freshman, not to mention our run game establishing itself on the other side of the ball.
JW may have raised his ceiling with this year's results, but he still seems too bought into UCB admin's narrative of "football within our pretentious limits." Honestly, I'd love a contrast of UO star LB Wilcox going Ray Nitschke versus the urbane, constrained scholar Wilcox on the sidelines we see. I think I already have the lecture notes for our next loss, "We need to do better...we need to execute better...mistakes were made...et cetera."
Honestly, I don’t think he would. He is what he is. It’s the CEO type stuff he struggles with, and his program management skills are lacking. The team is often unprepared for games, and they usually lack mental toughness.
Guys, maybe we're going about this all wrong. Instead of being critical of our fabulous coach, we should be embracing a higher ceiling elsewhere. Spread the word on social media. Get Canzano on board. Maybe it'll get around and sink in so some other incompetent AD makes JW an offer and steals him away.
I know we share disappointment that Wilcox has not delivered the goods (my bet is his personal disappointment far exceeds ours) but I agree that now is not the time to make a change and I welcome his continued leadership as we transition into the ACC. Go Bears!
To be honest, if you think any of these guys are simply in it for the money, I think you may be missing the point. They all get paid zillions ...Tedford was the highest paid employee of the state of CA at one point if I remember correctly. And given that market, they would be stupid for not getting the best deal they can. But to get to the top coaching ranks it is not about the money...it's about competition and winning...and we have not, so that is bad and Wilcox may well be beyond his sell by date...my point was simply I feel that right now is not the best time for all concerned, in my judgement.
It made little sense, and the source that first reported it is a complete fraud.
Wilcox does have a good agent, tho. To keep drumming up apparent interest everywhere for a milquetoast client that loses more than he wins is really something, all under the tired “it’s tough to win at Cal” refrain…maybe Wilcox’s handler wants to run the Cal athletic department?
Not sure we know what happened, but there is a difference between "reached out" and "interviewed." I get reached out to by recruiters all the time, but I don't interview. You only interview when you're interested in moving. So I think (if the report is true, and that's a very big if) if Wilcox actually interviewed, then OP's point is a reasonable one.
Same. It just doesn't make much sense, unless he just hates it in Berkeley and would be willing to take a pay cut to go coach somewhere that's about to get their roster raided (with no ability to go portal shopping on his own).
That’s exactly what occurred to me. Pretty rough timing on that one. It was just announced a day or two before the SJSU coach jumped ship. Maybe he’ll end up at Cal instead
Oh no. I’m also a big Cornhusker fan. He was the #3 until the two guys ahead of him proved to be turnover machines. Sadly, he followed in the same vein. You can look up his amazing run through the whole Wisconsin defense at the beginning of the game this year. It looked for a second like they were going to run the Badgers out of the stadium. I think the offense produced a grand total of three more points the entire game. I just thought it would be fun to have him around.
I didn't read "Wilcox extension" in this article so I guess things are as fine as they were a week ago. Also, I do not recommend reading "Wilcox extension" out loud.
Keep Wilcox, he's getting 5-star players to commit now that he's staying!
https://twitter.com/BobbyEngstler/status/1747382782454575383?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Etweet
Kicker ratings are weird but this kid may reduce heartburn symptoms for us next year.
a full scholly for a 2* punter? We couldn't find any Aussies to walk on? OTOH, he aced it at kicking camp.
"Despite lacking ratings from major scouting organizations, Engstler’s abilities have made him a coveted recruit for college football programs"
https://fanrecap.com/article-829727/#google_vignette
I suppose the operative word in his write-up was "despite", damn seems that schollie would have been well served on an OL or DL. Dunno.
or maybe kept the kicker that was more successful than the kicker under scholly.
I know most Cal fans want Wilcox gone and I won't defend him (like I did for a certain other coach...), but this would've been a truly terrible time for him to leave.
It would've opened up the transfer portal and we'd be gutted without an opportunity to make things up with other transfers. And not to mention that puts players like Ott at risk of transferring as well.
Best to get one season in the ACC and then if we get rid of Wilcox to do it early before the portal and early signing day closes.
Also I don't want Knowlton hiring anyone else.
By what evidence do you come up with the statement that "most" Cal fans want Wilcox gone? Most fans with a knowledge of football intricacies don't necessarily agree with you. There are many other factors that make a team a winner other than the head coach and Cal has troubles in a lot of areas other than the coaching of their teams. Campus administration, AD's, the city of Berkeley, recruiting money (including (NIL), and the constant turnover of assistant coaches and staff.
"Most fans with a knowledge of football intricacies don't necessarily agree with you. "
Yeah, they are called apologists.
Seriously. Excuse after excuse…it does grow rather tiresome, really.
It’s not the Cal administration’s fault that in his first 6 seasons, Justin Wilcox was unable to produce a competent backup QB that could even consistently complete a pass. And the turnover in staff because of mistakes made when you hire your buddies is not the responsibility of the guy making those hires.
Does being more aware of the nuances of football allow one to see that being 21-37 in conference really has nothing to do with the Head Coach? Who knew.
And don't' forget COVID, and City of Berkeley. Those two are solely responsible at least 4 of the bad seasons.
I mean to be fair - quite a few folks (myself included) have been HIGHLY critical of Wilcox and would have welcomed an alternative if one could be found. I think when one says "most fans with a knowledge of football intricacies..." I think you are basically counting MOST casual and even passionate fans out. Wilcox has had quite a few disappointing aspects to his tenure especially with respect to offensive capability so it's reasonable to consider his replacement. I also agree with royrules22 regarding what a difficult position Cal would be in if Wilcox HAD left for another job.
Wow that is not the sentence that I thought would come under fire. I don't know most fans. I only the fans I know and what I read on WFC or other social media. There's a sentiment of frustration at Wilcox and a wish he would go to AZ or something. I merely expressed that if he were to leave now it would be bad.
And yes I made a generalization instead of writing a scientific analysis of who actually wanted him gone. I did that so I can get to what I actually wanted to say. Do you have any other criticism for my casual comment?
And please defend your statement of "most fans with a knowledge of football intricacies" don't want him gone. I have counters so how can you say "most fans"? Or were you also making a simplification as I did?
I put most in italics because it's an ambiguous term. Most of all fans? Or most of fans you know or read about.
Just chiming in to say that as much as the internet likes to espouse "technically correct is the best kind of correct", it really isn't the case. You need to be able to make social judgements as to when minor contesting of world usage is worth anything.
Meh from this perspective, there's never a good time for a coaching change. The best time would have been years ago, the second best time is right now. Delaying the inevitable won't help - hell this is a great time where expectations are low, new conference foes won't know much about us, etc. Not sure what will be better next year outside of yet another year of unrealized potential and mediocrity (if we're lucky).
There is a right time. In December. Yes people will transfer out, but it'll give us an opportunity to pick up other players from the portal as well.
Also I'm hoping Knowlton gets the boot first as well
Also the expectation isn't really low right now. The trend is slightly upwards.
Yeah a coaching change right now would be a disaster. We need all the stability we can get heading into a new conference. We can work on an upgrade later.
This exactly.
It's too late now, but I would have taken a Brennan for Wilcox trade in a heartbeat. You want to talk lousy institutional support for football? Then go visit San Jose State. Wilcox might be the luckiest man in college football, having parlayed the Oregon hiring hoax into a bloated $4.75 million salary and being able to crow about reaching a bowl game in 2023 based on a pure fluke. That fluke being Ethan Garbers getting knocked out in the first five minutes of the UCLA game. This is a good hire for Arizona, and they were decisive in making it without giving nary a thought to Wilcox.
Without wanting to defend JW, calling the bowl game a fluke is disingenuous. The team finished off the season on a great 3win streak and earned it.
Take away some abysmal refereeing "flukes" earlier this season and it doesn't even come down to that. We had a scoop and score taken off the board against Auburn for fuck sake lol.
I was dancing on the ceiling when Cal beat UCLA, but I still maintain the win was a fluke. And maybe Cal's belly flop in the Independence Bowl proves the point. UCLA was a totally different team when Garbers played as shown the week before when the Bruins decimated USC, and in their bowl game when he came in during the second half and led them to a come from behind win over Boise State. Remember Dave Barr in 1993? Cal was 8-0 in games he played in and finished, and a dismal 0-4 in games he sat out due to injury. Same thing.
We have our own share of "What if Garbers wasn't injured?", I'm not going to lose sleep over UCLA's. Still, I get your point. I'm just pointing out it goes both ways. And, generally, flukes seem to go against us, so it just doesn't feel right to qualify our wins the one time it goes in our favor.
Also, it would be more typiCAL fashion if their backup came in and lit us up. So there's something to be said about our defense making it a rough day for their freshman, not to mention our run game establishing itself on the other side of the ball.
My neighbor’s daughter is a recent SJSU grad. I mentioned that SJSU was in a bowl game. She asked back, “Really?”
The sad fact is it would be no surprise to have the same exchange with a recent Cal grad.
Maybe JW has not lost the locker room, but what about the stands?
bummer for San Jose St; I love what Brennan did for them. I'm glad that Wilcox is not gone.
Whew! That was close. /sarcasm font
JW may have raised his ceiling with this year's results, but he still seems too bought into UCB admin's narrative of "football within our pretentious limits." Honestly, I'd love a contrast of UO star LB Wilcox going Ray Nitschke versus the urbane, constrained scholar Wilcox on the sidelines we see. I think I already have the lecture notes for our next loss, "We need to do better...we need to execute better...mistakes were made...et cetera."
Wilco Wilcox.
C'mon, Coach, unplug and tell it like it is.
#WilcoxUnplugged #BeastModeWilcox
THIS is his ceiling.
Are you sure he would not have a higher ceiling elsewhere?
Honestly, I don’t think he would. He is what he is. It’s the CEO type stuff he struggles with, and his program management skills are lacking. The team is often unprepared for games, and they usually lack mental toughness.
A coach with a hire ceiling doesn’t lose games he is favored to win. A coach with a hire ceiling doesn’t lose in Colorado in 22 or Arizona in 21.
Guys, maybe we're going about this all wrong. Instead of being critical of our fabulous coach, we should be embracing a higher ceiling elsewhere. Spread the word on social media. Get Canzano on board. Maybe it'll get around and sink in so some other incompetent AD makes JW an offer and steals him away.
I see a coach that looks lost on the sidelines, the complete opposite of a scholar
You see a coach struggling for relevance...
You see Cal football.
Now that's a branding campaign!
Right? Dovetails off the previous one pretty darn good.
All that's left is to shoehorn in "Berkeley."
FITY
You see Cal Berkeley football.
That'll be $10K please.
Please send invoice to Jim Knowlton.
fyi - he played DB not LB :) ..so perhaps a Jack Tatum reference instead of Nitschke
Oops. So, the Assassin, eh? Still a far cry from what we see on the sidelines.
Speculation never a glimmer to start with from where I type.
I know we share disappointment that Wilcox has not delivered the goods (my bet is his personal disappointment far exceeds ours) but I agree that now is not the time to make a change and I welcome his continued leadership as we transition into the ACC. Go Bears!
I’m sure the millions of dollars he has been paid to compile a losing overall record and Pac12 records helps ease the personal disappointment.
To be honest, if you think any of these guys are simply in it for the money, I think you may be missing the point. They all get paid zillions ...Tedford was the highest paid employee of the state of CA at one point if I remember correctly. And given that market, they would be stupid for not getting the best deal they can. But to get to the top coaching ranks it is not about the money...it's about competition and winning...and we have not, so that is bad and Wilcox may well be beyond his sell by date...my point was simply I feel that right now is not the best time for all concerned, in my judgement.
Did anyone really think they were going to hire Wilcox? Smells a lot like Wilcox's agent trying to get his client another extension.
It made little sense, and the source that first reported it is a complete fraud.
Wilcox does have a good agent, tho. To keep drumming up apparent interest everywhere for a milquetoast client that loses more than he wins is really something, all under the tired “it’s tough to win at Cal” refrain…maybe Wilcox’s handler wants to run the Cal athletic department?
When your head coach starts applying other places, what does that tell you? Do I need to say more.
Like Sonny?
It sounds as if Arizona reached out to him, not the other way around.
Not sure we know what happened, but there is a difference between "reached out" and "interviewed." I get reached out to by recruiters all the time, but I don't interview. You only interview when you're interested in moving. So I think (if the report is true, and that's a very big if) if Wilcox actually interviewed, then OP's point is a reasonable one.
UA sources say he was reached out to. Only one particular writer (with a non-favorable reputation) claims he actually interview as far as I know.
I would be shocked if he actually interviewed.
Same. It just doesn't make much sense, unless he just hates it in Berkeley and would be willing to take a pay cut to go coach somewhere that's about to get their roster raided (with no ability to go portal shopping on his own).
For all the talk of the Cal athletic department’s financial woes, U of A is in as bad or worse of a position.
wonder if chubba purdy reconsiders his commitment to SJSU
That’s exactly what occurred to me. Pretty rough timing on that one. It was just announced a day or two before the SJSU coach jumped ship. Maybe he’ll end up at Cal instead
We would have had him if the Niners didn't move to Santa Clara.
(But, yes, maybe he will come to Cal. Probably won't beat out Nando but Nando seems like the type of guy who thrives on competition.)
His performance records are nothing like his brother
Oh no. I’m also a big Cornhusker fan. He was the #3 until the two guys ahead of him proved to be turnover machines. Sadly, he followed in the same vein. You can look up his amazing run through the whole Wisconsin defense at the beginning of the game this year. It looked for a second like they were going to run the Badgers out of the stadium. I think the offense produced a grand total of three more points the entire game. I just thought it would be fun to have him around.
From your lips to Oski's ears.
But are we really expecting a Mr. Irrelevant 2.0?
His stats aren't that good.
Right, I would take him as it would add competition, potential depth and a player with starting experience but he wasn’t very good at Nebraska.