24 Comments

O-line or no o-line, Goff is not a good NFL QB. The fact that the Rams were willing to throw in two 1st rounders and a 3rd just for a guy who's an older, middle tier QB goes to show how little Goff is valued throughout the league. And make no mistake, Detroit took Goff not for the future, but knowing they will be replacing him with a prospect over this year or next year's draft. I'm hard pressed to recall an NFL trade where a team paid so handsomely just to move on from a guy.

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I hope I'm wrong, but I'd say that they had to give up two 1st rounders and a 3rd just to let go of him for a QB who is not quite a star and is closer to the sunset of his career says enough. His production has really deteriorated over the past two seasons. Detroit is as always in rebuilding mode and this allows them to take a flyer and get picks to address their many. He's not Alex Smith, but he's also not Matt Stafford either.

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If the Rams don’t win it all in 21, they will regret this deal big time. As much as I like Goff, Stafford probably gives them a better chance to win immediately but after ‘22, they might be screwed by this short term thinking if they don’t get to the SB. McVay realizes he has to win NOW to maintain the confidence of his players and staff and keep his job and lost patience with Goff

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Wow, I don't follow the NFL closely, but this really sucks (if Detroit continues to be a weak franchise). Putting the blame on him for the Rams not winning it all? ok... I believe in Goff and that the Rams just made themselves worse. I'm not a 49er fan, but would've been had he ended up here. I guess I'll be rooting for Detroit now, hope they make use of the extra draft picks.

By the way, Davis Webb in the news: https://www.buffalobills.com/news/bills-signed-these-13-players-to-reserve-future-contracts

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At least now when you knock Goff down, he's going to get up and on the way up, he's going to bite a kneecap off.  And he's going to stand up and it's going to take two more shots to knock him down. And on the way up, Goff's going to take your other kneecap and he's going to get up and it's going to take three shots to get Goff down. And when he does, Goff's going to take another hunk out of you.

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I fear that the O-line situation in Detroit will be just as bad as LA's, Not sure how creative/effective Goff can be. It would nice to see him rebound after two relatively "meh" years. Also, Goff was very good - but not perfect at Cal. Consider his two worst games - the rain game vs. Oregon and the Pac-12 showdown against Utah where Cal had a chance to make a national statement but Jared had four or five ints as I recall.

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That Cal-Utah game was just weird altogether - I actually went to that game and, along with the Utah fans around me, couldn't believe what was going on as each team had 4-5 turnovers. Only game that felt weirder was the Cheez-It Bowl where a TCU fan and I were yelling at our teams to stop passing to avoid a turnover.

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Too bad Marvin Jones is now leaving Detroit. Would have been my #2 team if they can have both.

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Prior to the trade, the Rams were in the 4th worst cap situation in the NFL, already $27.7 million over the 2021 cap. They still need to eat $22.2 million in dead cap space for Goff's contract in 2021 (instead of the $34.6 million to keep him), plus any of Goff's bonuses. So this nets $12 million in cap space, but then you take on $20 million for Stafford's 2021 contract.

So now the Rams are even further over the salary cap, plus they traded two first round and a third round pick. The Rams are going to have to make some tough decisions to let go of players in 2021 since they won't be able to afford them any more salary cap-wise (e.g. Joe Johnson).

The Rams still have an awful offensive line and no deep threat receiver. Instead of improving in the draft or in free agency, they mortgaged their future by trading away their picks and making their salary cap situation worse. But sure, Goff was the problem, right?

Anyone who thinks Goff was holding the Rams back is in for a rude awakening. Just wish they'd have sent Goff into a better situation.

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That O-Line was atrocious. You'd think the Rams would work to build up against the weaknesses of Goff which (his immobility), but no they just keep looking for shiny toy after shiny toy.

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I mean lets not avoid the idea that Goff was still part of the problem. He may not be the root cause but I feel like he has fallen off of a cliff these past 2 seasons, with him looking so damn uncomfortable making any throw over 15+ yards. Of course some of that can and should be attributed to the O line (namely the Guards) but Goff for his part hasn't shown me a damn thing to be excited about since 2018, he's a shell of his Cal self. Teams with poor o lines like Seattle, Buffalo, and to an extent KC and even TB have proven that you can get it done with a subpar O line, which really exposed Goff and his lack of versatility I mean he even looks like a truck while scrambling.

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Every year, McVay comes up with a clever new offensive scheme, and every year, Belichick or a Belichick-disciple figures it out. This year, to combat the weak offensive line, McVay designed a whole new system with play-action and designed QB rollouts to have the QB run away from pressure and thus make the offensive line's job easier (and the QB's job harder, as you have a set amount of time to throw, and throwing on the run is always harder than when you set your feet). With no deep threat receiver, and a weak offensive line, what are you supposed to do if no one is open and you have pressure in your face? You can try to create a play out of nothing-- a pro-style QB can make a tough throw in a tight window (to a receiver that's not open), and a dual-style QB can run the ball himself. Both options carry the risk of a turnover (INT/fumble).

Of course, it's a big ask for a QB to do this all game, all season. Aaron Rodgers got away with it under McCarthy until the playoffs, but for a while Rodgers had very little in the way of help in the offensive scheme. This year, McVay's offensive would have worked much better for a dual-threat QB-- roll out of the pocket, no one is open, run the ball yourself. That's not who Jared Goff is, and while it may have been a fundamentally sound offense, McVay did not build an offense around his QB's strengths (the way he did in 2018), he instead built an offense to combat his team's weakness, and I guess just assumed Goff should be able to carry the rest of the load after his huge contract. His coaches basically shit on him late in the season for his turnovers, so later in the season/playoffs, he'd just eat the sack instead (watch this example from the Rams-Packers game, 2:40 if the timestamp doesn't work: https://youtu.be/mp0c8xkCacM?t=160). You blame Goff for the turnovers, well, he stopped turning the ball over (even with a goddamn broken thumb!!!) and the Rams still lost. Guess it's all Goff's fault though.

His coaches lost confidence in him, and there's no coming back from that. Hope he's able to start fresh in Detroit and make the Rams regret that decision.

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those PA rollouts away from the O line were already a staple of that Mcvay offense since they had Gurley, although there was considerably less straight up play action from the pocket over the last 2 seasons as you note. I do agree that a more athletic qb would help develop the system Mcvay made to mask the O line defencies, but Goff for his part did not hold up his end of the bargain with 2 top 15 WR's in Kupp and Woods who can run a variety of routes. The Rams did shaft him in not bringing in a viable TE for him to throw to the past few seasons and the coaches essentially did him no favors as you said. However even before the broken thumb, Goff still couldn't hold himself to passes further than 15 yards, he simply could not do it, even his freshman year Cal self seemed to have more confidence in himself. Stafford is clearly an upgrade at the position and while Goff like I said isn't the sole problem, he caved to himself and the coaches unlike say a Joe Burrow in Cincy who had a death wish with that O line and those coaches. Goff simply hasn't progressed enough to be the franchise, much like Carson Wentz and Sam Darnold have, and the Rams moved on after 2 years of meh, I can't say I would not have done the same thing after Derek Carr's 2018 and 2019 seasons with Oakland. Goff's thumb was obviously not ideal but the future was set in stone, the way Mcvay wanted to ideally set up his team required an upgrade.

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For sure, someone like Goff is a dinosaur now. Mobility is the new nfl QB. It's just sad to see him the last 2 years when before, keeping him upright was key to allowing him to do some things.

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Jan 31, 2021
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I've seen you comment on Goff's mobility a lot, but you should know that it's actually considered one of his strengths. You probably won't find this satisfying, but here's someone who breaks down film mention Goff's mobility in passing (around the 5:25 mark: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HeG3MKJzyPU).

Mobility in the pocket and ability to elude the rush is a skill that is a lot more subtle than you're probably thinking. When you point to Patrick Mahomes or Lamar Jackson, they're not eluding the rush, they're just rushing the ball themselves on their feet. Goff is really good at knowing when to step up in the pocket and being able to move around in the pocket (and it might not be super obvious if you're not watching his feet move, because it might not look like he's moving a lot when you watch from the TV's bird's eye view), but if you were to see the field from Goff's eyes, you'd see offensive linemen being shoved back into you, defensive linemen and linebackers jumping up and throwing their hands up in the air to bat down passes, etc. Goff needs to be able to maneuver around all sorts of obstacles flying at him while still keeping his eyes downfield, and this is actually something he does really well (when you take your eyes off the routes your receivers are running downfield/how the defense is reacting to it, and instead have to watch your surroundings to make sure you don't get sacked, a dual-threat QB may be able to dodge and duck and weave and escape the pocket, but he hasn't been reading the play developing, and that's why they usually opt to run the ball so frequently when they run into trouble).

So yes, Goff actually does have very good mobility in the pocket and the ability to elude the rush (moving around in the pocket, stepping up, keeping his feet moving, etc., all while keeping his eyes downfield). What Goff doesn't have is the ability to create plays on his feet after a play has already broken down, the way someone like Mahomes or Jackson does. That's just not his skill set (and it's not necessarily any better than Goff's skillset, it's merely different-- is it better to sit in the pocket and spend more time reading and watching plays develop, or is it better to make quicker/simpler reads and run the ball yourself if you don't like what you see?).

Goff shouldn't be asked to "elude the rush" in the manner you're suggesting-- e.g. take the Packers-Rams playoffs game (skip to 2:40 if the timestamp doesn't work: https://youtu.be/mp0c8xkCacM?t=160). This sort of play isn't on Goff, it's on his offensive lineman (and OL Bobby Evans was routinely dominated the entire game).

Further, McVay draws up late-developing plays (receivers running long routes), while incorporating play-action, roll-outs, and run fakes (i.e. Goff has to turn his back to the defense as he fakes a handoff to his RB, which gives him even less time to react to pressure, as an OL could be losing his matchup but Goff doesn't even know it yet since his back is turned), and the Rams had a pretty weak offensive line, and so this happened a lot. Basically, I think McVay failed Goff and didn't put him in a position to succeed-- McVay essentially drew up plays that start Goff in a big hole, and got frustrated when Goff wasn't immediately hurdling out of the hole each time, when McVay could have just as easily not put Goff in the hole in the first place (but hey, Goff was getting paid the big bucks, so now it's his responsibility to make it happen no matter what).

The way the Rams have been handling the whole breakup has put me firmly in Camp Goff, and I really doubt they're going to do all that much better with Stafford next year. But this time, McVay won't have his QB to throw under the bus, and if Stafford struggles, everyone will finally know who really was to blame.

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Feb 3, 2021
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"it seems he is slow to make a decision, perhaps early enough, to evade the rush"

I think the point I was trying to make is that the plays McVay has drawn up these past two years have put Goff at a disadvantage like this-- turning your back to the field on a play-action, and you don't get to see pressure as it's developing or where it's coming from until it's too late. Similarly, people say "he's slow to make decisions" or "makes bad reads" but it's the same idea, he's losing time he could be spending watching the field every time he has to turn his back on a run fake, things like that.

I watched the Mahomes video, and that's the kind of offensive situation I wish Goff were in. Just watching the clips, look how much time Mahomes has to throw. And when he does throw, he's throwing a long bomb to a receiver that has beaten a defensive back deep. McVay was drawing up a dink-and-dunk offense for Goff in 2019-2020 because the offensive line was one of the worst in the NFL (especially in 2019, which explains the adjustments I mentioned in the previous post) and because the Rams simply don't have a receiver that can consistently get open deep. I feel like this is the role Josh Reynolds was supposed to fill, but Reynolds was terrible at it. I looked up his PFF scouting report out of curiosity (https://www.pff.com/news/draft-pff-scouting-report-josh-reynolds-wr-texas-am), and this has not translated well to the NFL. "What he does best": Deep threat? Nope, struggles to get open deep, not fast enough. Strong hands? Nope, tons of dropped balls. Big catch radius, contested catches? Nope, not really.

Oh well. I hope Detroit is willing to invest in their offense for Goff and give him at least one stud receiver, particularly one that can get open deep.

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would say it was a clear strength in fact. Any successful Cal QB must elude the rush due to lack of elite Oline play. He rolled out, improvised, went through progressions and scrambled for yards as well as any pro style college QB as I remember. He threw some absolute dimes while on the run in college. I think the Rams just became a bad fit for him and both parties will be better off apart. Goff has talent and a desire to fix his weaknesses and will find success in Detroit...or maybe eventually New England where another tall, skinny kid from NoCal who wore blue and gold in college did pretty OK for himself...Pats (who I frigin hate) need a QB and BB knows how to design a scheme for dudes like Goff. Just a thought

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Jan 31, 2021
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Rodgers should have thrown a forward lateral pass on that play.

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The Rams are trying real hard to be terrible. I feel bad for Goff being shipped the Siberia of the NFL but the Lions have a new GM that hopefully can use those picks to help rebuild around Goff.

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Goff just got shipped to football hell.....

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Well, it's definitely ended his time as a golden boy in LA

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Rams got robbed.

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More a case of self-mutilation.

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