How do you attract prime talent (or fans) to a program that randomly plays at 7:30pm PST, and performs <.500 for more than half of the last 30yrs? Long term fans aren’t fickle, they are tired. And the portal door is looming large..
If you are traveling from out of the area (eg San Diego) you have to book overnight accommodation for a 7:30p game, and do it at last-minute prices. So for us fans who travel it does make a difference.
If Cal is going to struggle like this, I would much rather see it happen with the guys that choose to come to Cal out of high school rather than transfers. So let's see Kai.
The failure to develop a QB from our own recruits is troubling. Why we would get a guy riding the pine at Purdue (hardly a football powerhouse) and anoint him as the starter at Cal (a school with a strong legacy of sending QB's to the pros)? What's wrong with this picture? Sure he's been courageous but also ineffective both at the start of games and in crunch time. HS kids should be lining up to be the next Cal pro QB prospect. I would say give Kai the damn ball and see what he can do.
I agree that the coaches should give Milner some meaningful snaps, but to say that they "anointed" Plummer is just wrong. He came in, worked hard, did great in spring ball and fall camp, won the respect of his teammates, and was named starter. His arm strength is an obvious improvement over Garbers. Oh, and Purdue does have a pretty decent legacy at QB -- see e.g., Bob Griese and Drew Brees.
I feel like the only time Cal had a functional offense in the Wilcox era was when Garbers was a true threat to run (before they tried to make him into a pocket passer). So yeah a dual threat, RPO QB is the only way forward with a bad O line.
LOL. Yes, there is an emphasis on passing on third downs because Cal is typically way behind the chains on third down. I think I read somewhere that Cal is right up there in the nation in the number of series that lead to third downs because of the futility on first and second downs. It was the same way last year, too.
Thanks Nick. I'm going through the stages of withdrawal. It's an odd feeling. I just don't care enough to engage anymore. And that's a painful thing. A loss of part of my identity and happiness. You nail some things on the head. I'm a reasonably well to do alum that the program needs, and I'm not spending my energy on the team anymore. As others have said, the new coaches around the league, the teams of similar talent, that make us look so incompetent on offense...it's just sad. There is no way we should be favored to win another game this year. OSU will crush us. Even Furd, should win.
It's the classic definition of insanity by thinking things will get better when Wilcox ushers in a third OC and OL coach next season. The man does not have the vision of a head coach; so not thinking like a head coach, he will hire another Wisconsin style ball control dude as his OC to run the defense in his image.
"He will hire another Wisconsin style ball control dude as his OC". Neither Baldwin nor Musgrave are Wisconsin style OCs. Baldwin ran a spread offense at EWU and Cal, Musgrave runs a hybrid WCO/E-P with am emphasis on passing if we look on 3rd down play calling distribution.
This might come off as really crumudgeny, but i was embarrassed by how the student section couldn't stop throwing trash/paper airplanes at the field/cheerleaders/team. I get that you're bored (and probably drunk) but throwing trash? Maybe I just haven't been to that many games that close to the student section recently.
yeah, you're (we're) old. I actually don't care if the students have some sort of life in them. I remember the students in the 90's getting so blasted that they body surfed down the student section only to end up lying down near the band section after the card stunts. what little security we had just let them lie down there...unless they wore red, when they had to move them because, well, you know
So much this. I believe this is why they need to make significant coaching changes immediately after the season is complete (if not sooner). I'm not saying Wilcox needs to be fired, but Musgrave has to go.
after attending the poopfests live (save Colorado) at CMS, I a have learned a lot about bad football. much like how you can learn about the human body by way of diseases, deficiencies, and duress, I think with the current personnel we could benefit hugely from a full back (a la number 99 malik). what happened to tagaloa? he played during the zona game, yes? also, plummer needs to friggen get rid of the ball sooner- that is coachable. he needs to keep a 2 second count in his head or something
College football is not terrible; Cal offensive football is terrible.
This is why, despite Nick's observation that it won't win games this year, it makes sense to remove the OC, and maybe do something with the O-line coaching besides bringing on Greatwood for what's probably a short term deal. He could shepherd the o-line the rest of the way. And a new permanent OC would want to choose his O-line coach.
You make a change now to try to win, or at least not lose, games not now, but in the next couple of seasons, by saving some semblance of recruiting. Until there is some tangible indication that there will be something done to address the issues with the offense, much less what that might be that might actually be effective, it strains credibility to envision any scenario where any difference maker, HS recruit or transfer, would choose to tank their career by going to (or staying at) Cal.
The issue is that there is no one in the coaching market that would be willing to take on a job half way through the season with no BYE week to work with. He'd have to maintain the play-book and verbiage because changing that mid-season is a recipe for disaster.
It's personnel issue at Cal, we don't have a QB coach or passing/running game coordinator in waiting to take over OC duties. Nor do we have a OL coach in the wings, Saffel is a GA and would not be able to take over duties.
Wilcox never striked me as a man who is willing to make changes for cosmetic/PR looks, and as of now unless Vince Lombardi himself were to rise from the dead and be willing to be Zombie OC for 6 weeks we will stay this. I do expect a lot of changes in the off-season.
I just don't know how we keep our best players from transferring and actually recruit. Bring in Marshawn as Rope Coach or something. If we can't be good, maybe we have to be fun.
I don't disagree, but by then the December signing class will be signed somewhere, mostly somewhere else than Berkeley. And a big percentage of those transferring will have already done so.
Cal really put themselves in a corner with an assemblage of staff on the offensive side of the ball that demonstrated the vision of a blind man wearing a blindfold in the dark. There should be an up and comer that is also a recruiting asset in the staff somewhere.
At this point, about the best thing Cal can do is dump the OC to demonstrate that something will be done, and go to work now so that as soon as the regular season ends, the announcement of the new (and hopefully more energizing) OC is ready to roll. That way prospects will have some idea of where things are headed.
We're in a new environment in college football. A lot will depend on the chops of the athletic director in setting a course which can be successful. So far I see (or UC) a place where there is no realization that there has been a tectonic shift in how to run a Power 5 program.
I propose that we put the entire Cal team in a box for the remainder of the season. That will serve two purposes: 1) we won't have to watch them; and 2) as Schrodinger postulated, while the team is in the box, they will have simultaneously both won and lost their remaining games, which should give them enough to qualify for a bowl.
How do you attract prime talent (or fans) to a program that randomly plays at 7:30pm PST, and performs <.500 for more than half of the last 30yrs? Long term fans aren’t fickle, they are tired. And the portal door is looming large..
Colorado, despite having 1 winning season since 2010 (not counting 4-2 in 2020) packed their house against Cal.
Sure the team should compete and win but our fandom is more fickle than a newly born cryptocurrency scam.
So true, and it’s not like the greater Denver metro area is a rural flat spanse of emptiness with nothing better to do.
Every team in the conference has to randomly play at 7:30pm sometimes, so that isn't an excuse.
The W-L record is the real issue.
If you are traveling from out of the area (eg San Diego) you have to book overnight accommodation for a 7:30p game, and do it at last-minute prices. So for us fans who travel it does make a difference.
If Cal is going to struggle like this, I would much rather see it happen with the guys that choose to come to Cal out of high school rather than transfers. So let's see Kai.
Almost every starting QB in the P12 is a hired gun...I don't think "QB development" is our issue.
Now OL development, on the other hand...
The failure to develop a QB from our own recruits is troubling. Why we would get a guy riding the pine at Purdue (hardly a football powerhouse) and anoint him as the starter at Cal (a school with a strong legacy of sending QB's to the pros)? What's wrong with this picture? Sure he's been courageous but also ineffective both at the start of games and in crunch time. HS kids should be lining up to be the next Cal pro QB prospect. I would say give Kai the damn ball and see what he can do.
I agree that the coaches should give Milner some meaningful snaps, but to say that they "anointed" Plummer is just wrong. He came in, worked hard, did great in spring ball and fall camp, won the respect of his teammates, and was named starter. His arm strength is an obvious improvement over Garbers. Oh, and Purdue does have a pretty decent legacy at QB -- see e.g., Bob Griese and Drew Brees.
I fear for an inexperienced quarterbacks mental health and physical safety with this O-line, seriously.
We need a guy with legs right now. The pro pocket passing ideal is not tenable with this line.
I feel like the only time Cal had a functional offense in the Wilcox era was when Garbers was a true threat to run (before they tried to make him into a pocket passer). So yeah a dual threat, RPO QB is the only way forward with a bad O line.
LOL. Yes, there is an emphasis on passing on third downs because Cal is typically way behind the chains on third down. I think I read somewhere that Cal is right up there in the nation in the number of series that lead to third downs because of the futility on first and second downs. It was the same way last year, too.
Thanks Nick. I'm going through the stages of withdrawal. It's an odd feeling. I just don't care enough to engage anymore. And that's a painful thing. A loss of part of my identity and happiness. You nail some things on the head. I'm a reasonably well to do alum that the program needs, and I'm not spending my energy on the team anymore. As others have said, the new coaches around the league, the teams of similar talent, that make us look so incompetent on offense...it's just sad. There is no way we should be favored to win another game this year. OSU will crush us. Even Furd, should win.
It's the classic definition of insanity by thinking things will get better when Wilcox ushers in a third OC and OL coach next season. The man does not have the vision of a head coach; so not thinking like a head coach, he will hire another Wisconsin style ball control dude as his OC to run the defense in his image.
"He will hire another Wisconsin style ball control dude as his OC". Neither Baldwin nor Musgrave are Wisconsin style OCs. Baldwin ran a spread offense at EWU and Cal, Musgrave runs a hybrid WCO/E-P with am emphasis on passing if we look on 3rd down play calling distribution.
Who is Troy Taylor? Does he have a Wikipedia?
What is Wikipedia?
This might come off as really crumudgeny, but i was embarrassed by how the student section couldn't stop throwing trash/paper airplanes at the field/cheerleaders/team. I get that you're bored (and probably drunk) but throwing trash? Maybe I just haven't been to that many games that close to the student section recently.
They've done this every year since I became a Cal fan, particularly at night games when the kids are usually liquored up. Even when we're good
Are sure it wasn't Ayoob in that section?
Only the paper airplanes. I recall someone threw a football which experience says was definitely not Ayoob.
yeah, you're (we're) old. I actually don't care if the students have some sort of life in them. I remember the students in the 90's getting so blasted that they body surfed down the student section only to end up lying down near the band section after the card stunts. what little security we had just let them lie down there...unless they wore red, when they had to move them because, well, you know
Guilty as charged - Class of ‘93
I think that behavior was new this week (aside from a few paper airplanes). Might be more drunk than average at 7:30p Saturday.
"What are the chances now, and into future seasons, that Cal can coach those players such that their talents are maximized?"
What are the odds Cal gets to coach those players at all? If I'm JMike, Ott, Mavin Anderson, etc. I'll see you in the transfer portal.
So much this. I believe this is why they need to make significant coaching changes immediately after the season is complete (if not sooner). I'm not saying Wilcox needs to be fired, but Musgrave has to go.
after attending the poopfests live (save Colorado) at CMS, I a have learned a lot about bad football. much like how you can learn about the human body by way of diseases, deficiencies, and duress, I think with the current personnel we could benefit hugely from a full back (a la number 99 malik). what happened to tagaloa? he played during the zona game, yes? also, plummer needs to friggen get rid of the ball sooner- that is coachable. he needs to keep a 2 second count in his head or something
Shock collar at 1.5 second mark?
That old meme keeps on keeping on: "No dreams, only tears now."
With offensive disasters like the last three games, how does Cal keep the talent it has without them getting poached.
College football is terrible.
College football is not terrible; Cal offensive football is terrible.
This is why, despite Nick's observation that it won't win games this year, it makes sense to remove the OC, and maybe do something with the O-line coaching besides bringing on Greatwood for what's probably a short term deal. He could shepherd the o-line the rest of the way. And a new permanent OC would want to choose his O-line coach.
You make a change now to try to win, or at least not lose, games not now, but in the next couple of seasons, by saving some semblance of recruiting. Until there is some tangible indication that there will be something done to address the issues with the offense, much less what that might be that might actually be effective, it strains credibility to envision any scenario where any difference maker, HS recruit or transfer, would choose to tank their career by going to (or staying at) Cal.
The issue is that there is no one in the coaching market that would be willing to take on a job half way through the season with no BYE week to work with. He'd have to maintain the play-book and verbiage because changing that mid-season is a recipe for disaster.
It's personnel issue at Cal, we don't have a QB coach or passing/running game coordinator in waiting to take over OC duties. Nor do we have a OL coach in the wings, Saffel is a GA and would not be able to take over duties.
Wilcox never striked me as a man who is willing to make changes for cosmetic/PR looks, and as of now unless Vince Lombardi himself were to rise from the dead and be willing to be Zombie OC for 6 weeks we will stay this. I do expect a lot of changes in the off-season.
I just don't know how we keep our best players from transferring and actually recruit. Bring in Marshawn as Rope Coach or something. If we can't be good, maybe we have to be fun.
I don't disagree, but by then the December signing class will be signed somewhere, mostly somewhere else than Berkeley. And a big percentage of those transferring will have already done so.
And not having any answers at OC and OL assuages those concerns how?
Cal really put themselves in a corner with an assemblage of staff on the offensive side of the ball that demonstrated the vision of a blind man wearing a blindfold in the dark. There should be an up and comer that is also a recruiting asset in the staff somewhere.
At this point, about the best thing Cal can do is dump the OC to demonstrate that something will be done, and go to work now so that as soon as the regular season ends, the announcement of the new (and hopefully more energizing) OC is ready to roll. That way prospects will have some idea of where things are headed.
We also have more coaches on defense than on offense if you include Wilcox.
When Charlie Ragle left, we did not add a ST coordinator but instead got an extra DB coach. We could have gotten a coach with specialty on offense.
1. Cal =/= Utah.
2. Greatwood is not allowed to get involved with playcalling or coaching during practices or games this includes in game communications.
We're in a new environment in college football. A lot will depend on the chops of the athletic director in setting a course which can be successful. So far I see (or UC) a place where there is no realization that there has been a tectonic shift in how to run a Power 5 program.
I propose that we put the entire Cal team in a box for the remainder of the season. That will serve two purposes: 1) we won't have to watch them; and 2) as Schrodinger postulated, while the team is in the box, they will have simultaneously both won and lost their remaining games, which should give them enough to qualify for a bowl.
Lmaoooo some Bill Musgrave praise coming from Troy Aikman during Monday Night Football.
Delete this
His release seemed a bit slow to me. Not sure how that's going to work at the next level.