Knowlton has two years to come up with a solution. Why take bold, timely, and aggressive action to preserve the Cal legacy when you can dawdle and spend time working on Mark Fox' extension.
Just some rando on Reddit so take it with a grain of salt, but:
“If I were Big10 Commissioner, I would be thinking about 3 potential sets of moves:
1. If the PAC12 looks like it might fall apart, try to lure away Stanford, Berkeley and Washington. Those are all AAU schools with fantastic academics. This both: (a) effectively creates a "west" division, and (b) brings the Big10 academics to the level of the ACC - which leads to 2. Also adds San Fran and Seattle television market.”
Create a real amateur conference just for "real" academic universities., minimum 3.2 GPA, no nil, cap on coach salaries, $10 game tickets and $2 beers.... Cal, 'furd, service academies, ivy schools.
You must be either really old and reminiscing like me or smoking something good 👍. Either way, I like the thought! Especially the part about the $2 beers 🍺! 😁
The PAC originated in 1915 with Cal, Washington, Oregon, and Oregon State. Cardinal and WSU joined by 1918. SC arrived in 1922 and UCLA in 1928. The rivalries and traditions and memories that were forged over a century have been casually dissolved with cynical disinterest.
I thought it was ridiculous when Texas and OK announced their move. I really think that this is even more ridiculous, short sighted and a mistake. Yeah money is important, but it can’t and shouldn’t dictate what you do in life. Another girding that’s helped stabilize society is falling. Even pro leagues have regional groupings of their teams for god’s sake!
Best observation about this that I saw earlier was that uclol and u$c had to do this in order to have the revenue to pay off their schools' respective pervy doctor scandals...
What do you mean. UCLA's recruiting is not going great. By saying they are moving to the Big Ten they might get some kids who think its a good thing. A lot of southern kids look down on the PAC 12.
If the P12 collapses, I think Big10 may look at Cal/Stanford due to AAU affiliations. It's a big deal to Big10 inclusion. All P12 schools except ASU/WSU/OSU are AAU members.
This is what happens when you hope instead of act. Pac-12’s lack of aggressiveness as far as expanding the conference left the conference vulnerable for too long. It was only a matter of time, though still shocking nonetheless. I just assumed OU would be the first to move.
This is like saying San Jose St didn't do enough to get into the SEC. What could the PAC have done? Adding lesser teams as you mention? Would you have hailed that as a great accomplishment prior to today's news? Doubtful. The only way to improve (some of) the PAC-12 schools positions is what's happening, basically breaking up the conference, and I don't see a conference leadership team wanting to destroy it's own conference. If this UCLA USC move were not happening, and the intact PAC-12 made it to 2024 with a new tv contract probably paying double what they get today, that would have been the best case scenario for the conference. We would still have been behind the SEC & B1G in dollars, and would have continued the slide down the competitiveness ladder, but still could pop into the CFP every few years, delaying the inevitable superconferences rising for a decade or so. The only current deal that would have benefited Cal sports would have been a (PAC-12 self-immolating) package sending UW (tv market #12), UofO (#21), Cal & Stanford (#6), & the LA schools (#2) to the B1G. Short of that, the PAC had no moves.
This right here but they did try to get OU and Texas, that didn’t work out. I feel like the Pac 12 didn’t have many good options after swinging and missing on OU and Texas.
With regard to UCLA and USC leaving the Pac-10, I say 'May the Door Hit Ya Where the Lord Split Ya...'. Just don't come crawling back to Pac-10 Conference if it doesn't work out, finanancially or otherwise. By the way, UCLA at least, is by charter supposed to be Non-Profit, as 'Student Fees' run through the State of California General Fund. If revenues were to go up for UCLA, all that revenue must still flow through the State and if the UC Regents allow UCLA to pocket any increased revenues, without at least offsetting the State for increased OTR costs associated with away games being further away, it could lead to Accounting Irregularities, in my oppinion. Cal '89.
Just an FYI - you are repeating a common misunderstanding about non-profit entities (btw - USC is a non-profit org.; UCLA is actually part of the state, also non-profit) --- that somehow they can't earn profits. Not true. The ONLY difference between for-profits and non-profits is that profits earned by the former inure to the owners or shareholders. Whereas profits earned by non-profits do not belong to anyone and must be used for the entity because non-profits are not owned by anyone (staff and directors cannot simply take the profit, though they can be paid) and there are no shareholders.
Hi L.A. Bear, I am not repeating a common misunderstanding. Either you did not fully read what I wrote or your understanding of GAAP as it applies to Non-Profit organizations may be lacking. I never said UCLA could not have revenues. It is the Accounting for said revenues that I was speaking to. Let's leave it there, shall we?
John, thanks for the clarification. When I reread your comment, you are right...I didn't get the main point, that somehow it would create accounting irregularities. I don't think, however, that would be the case. While it's true that each UC is part of the state, the system and each campus has its own budget and allocation, that are not part of the general fund. So as long as they reconcile their income and expenses, they'll be fine. Not only do they follow GAAP, but also stricter government accounting standards without any issues in the past.
A couple of things; UCLA is going to get pounded into oblivion in the Big Ten. There travel schedule will suck and their recruiting will suffer as a result. It's a path to doom for them. I honestly think USC will have big problems as well. Lincoln Riley runs an uptempo offense with a real shitty defense, typical of most teams in his former Big 12. I think in the ground and pound physical Big Ten that USC is going to have big problems with not just The Ohio State, but with Penn State, Michigan State, Michigan, Iowa, Wisconsin and the rest. I think Lincoln Riley took the USC job because he knew he could succeed in the PAC12. Let's see how long USC keeps paying his YUGE salary when he can't be in the top three in the Big Ten. Fuck em. CAL will go 11-1 and end up in the Playoffs.
UCLA is going to get a huge recruiting boost from this up front. Like, there goes every recruiting battle we might have with them at least in the near term. I'm not as quick to assume they get pounded. Look at how Texas A&M improved in the SEC. (Bad/unique example perhaps.) But outside of Ohio State, the b1g isnt exactly full of juggernauts, and that ground and pound stereotype is mostly a thing of the past outside of Iowa and maybe Wisconsin. And Pac10/12 teams have historically held their own against the B1G pretty well when they play.
Knowlton has two years to come up with a solution. Why take bold, timely, and aggressive action to preserve the Cal legacy when you can dawdle and spend time working on Mark Fox' extension.
Just some rando on Reddit so take it with a grain of salt, but:
“If I were Big10 Commissioner, I would be thinking about 3 potential sets of moves:
1. If the PAC12 looks like it might fall apart, try to lure away Stanford, Berkeley and Washington. Those are all AAU schools with fantastic academics. This both: (a) effectively creates a "west" division, and (b) brings the Big10 academics to the level of the ACC - which leads to 2. Also adds San Fran and Seattle television market.”
https://www.reddit.com/r/sports/comments/voe3l7/usc_and_ucla_set_to_join_big_ten/iedrlsr/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf&context=3
The answer remains, as always, F-CK L.A.
;-)
Create a real amateur conference just for "real" academic universities., minimum 3.2 GPA, no nil, cap on coach salaries, $10 game tickets and $2 beers.... Cal, 'furd, service academies, ivy schools.
You must be either really old and reminiscing like me or smoking something good 👍. Either way, I like the thought! Especially the part about the $2 beers 🍺! 😁
The PAC originated in 1915 with Cal, Washington, Oregon, and Oregon State. Cardinal and WSU joined by 1918. SC arrived in 1922 and UCLA in 1928. The rivalries and traditions and memories that were forged over a century have been casually dissolved with cynical disinterest.
This is a tremendously sad day.
sadness is my dominant emotion regarding all of this, thank you for putting it in a much more eloquent statement
I thought it was ridiculous when Texas and OK announced their move. I really think that this is even more ridiculous, short sighted and a mistake. Yeah money is important, but it can’t and shouldn’t dictate what you do in life. Another girding that’s helped stabilize society is falling. Even pro leagues have regional groupings of their teams for god’s sake!
"Another girding that’s helped stabilize society is falling."
Exactly.
Maybe I'm the only one one, but isn't this insane? Kinda ruins what made sports enjoyable for Cal fans.
Conference realignment is all fun in games until you’re on the outside looking in.
First they came for the Big East and I said nothing…then they came for the Big 12 and I said nothing…
UW and Oregon have officially applied to join the Big10.
Let’s check in with Berkeley…
Tumbleweeds and crickets.
MWC here we come!!
gonna LOL when Oregon is rejected
Oregon will bring Nike money to seal a Big-10 deal
Cal and Stanford should join to create a 20 team Big 10 Conference.
Best observation about this that I saw earlier was that uclol and u$c had to do this in order to have the revenue to pay off their schools' respective pervy doctor scandals...
jfc can this get any more depressing
Part of me thinks this announcement was just so these teams could get some recruits to sign early or flip to them.. What a fucking mess.
What?!?! This makes no sense.
What do you mean. UCLA's recruiting is not going great. By saying they are moving to the Big Ten they might get some kids who think its a good thing. A lot of southern kids look down on the PAC 12.
I see what you mean, I still think it is all about the money but I’m sure recruiting could benefit.
Looks like it's official now.
Yep, it is done.
If the P12 collapses, I think Big10 may look at Cal/Stanford due to AAU affiliations. It's a big deal to Big10 inclusion. All P12 schools except ASU/WSU/OSU are AAU members.
I believe that horse has left the barn. AAU affiliations? Lol.
The recent history of Cal football has felt like a controlled demolition.
Knowlton is scrutinizing the dessert card at Chez Panisse as we speak. Not sure he's even heard about any of this yet. Not that it would matter.
He's got bigger fish--like working out an extension for Mark Fox.
This is what happens when you hope instead of act. Pac-12’s lack of aggressiveness as far as expanding the conference left the conference vulnerable for too long. It was only a matter of time, though still shocking nonetheless. I just assumed OU would be the first to move.
This is like saying San Jose St didn't do enough to get into the SEC. What could the PAC have done? Adding lesser teams as you mention? Would you have hailed that as a great accomplishment prior to today's news? Doubtful. The only way to improve (some of) the PAC-12 schools positions is what's happening, basically breaking up the conference, and I don't see a conference leadership team wanting to destroy it's own conference. If this UCLA USC move were not happening, and the intact PAC-12 made it to 2024 with a new tv contract probably paying double what they get today, that would have been the best case scenario for the conference. We would still have been behind the SEC & B1G in dollars, and would have continued the slide down the competitiveness ladder, but still could pop into the CFP every few years, delaying the inevitable superconferences rising for a decade or so. The only current deal that would have benefited Cal sports would have been a (PAC-12 self-immolating) package sending UW (tv market #12), UofO (#21), Cal & Stanford (#6), & the LA schools (#2) to the B1G. Short of that, the PAC had no moves.
I think you were referring to U of O, right? Not OU...
Yep. Freudian slip.
This right here but they did try to get OU and Texas, that didn’t work out. I feel like the Pac 12 didn’t have many good options after swinging and missing on OU and Texas.
What would you have tried to have done?
In hindsight, even pulling some lesser schools like Boise State and Brigham Young.
With regard to UCLA and USC leaving the Pac-10, I say 'May the Door Hit Ya Where the Lord Split Ya...'. Just don't come crawling back to Pac-10 Conference if it doesn't work out, finanancially or otherwise. By the way, UCLA at least, is by charter supposed to be Non-Profit, as 'Student Fees' run through the State of California General Fund. If revenues were to go up for UCLA, all that revenue must still flow through the State and if the UC Regents allow UCLA to pocket any increased revenues, without at least offsetting the State for increased OTR costs associated with away games being further away, it could lead to Accounting Irregularities, in my oppinion. Cal '89.
It is a fantasy to think either school will come crawling back to anywhere.
Just an FYI - you are repeating a common misunderstanding about non-profit entities (btw - USC is a non-profit org.; UCLA is actually part of the state, also non-profit) --- that somehow they can't earn profits. Not true. The ONLY difference between for-profits and non-profits is that profits earned by the former inure to the owners or shareholders. Whereas profits earned by non-profits do not belong to anyone and must be used for the entity because non-profits are not owned by anyone (staff and directors cannot simply take the profit, though they can be paid) and there are no shareholders.
Hi L.A. Bear, I am not repeating a common misunderstanding. Either you did not fully read what I wrote or your understanding of GAAP as it applies to Non-Profit organizations may be lacking. I never said UCLA could not have revenues. It is the Accounting for said revenues that I was speaking to. Let's leave it there, shall we?
John, thanks for the clarification. When I reread your comment, you are right...I didn't get the main point, that somehow it would create accounting irregularities. I don't think, however, that would be the case. While it's true that each UC is part of the state, the system and each campus has its own budget and allocation, that are not part of the general fund. So as long as they reconcile their income and expenses, they'll be fine. Not only do they follow GAAP, but also stricter government accounting standards without any issues in the past.
1. P12 is done.
2. Cal may default on bond debt.
3. Do taxpayers pay bond holders if there is a default?
F—k UCLA. So unbelievably greedy and shitty of them.
A couple of things; UCLA is going to get pounded into oblivion in the Big Ten. There travel schedule will suck and their recruiting will suffer as a result. It's a path to doom for them. I honestly think USC will have big problems as well. Lincoln Riley runs an uptempo offense with a real shitty defense, typical of most teams in his former Big 12. I think in the ground and pound physical Big Ten that USC is going to have big problems with not just The Ohio State, but with Penn State, Michigan State, Michigan, Iowa, Wisconsin and the rest. I think Lincoln Riley took the USC job because he knew he could succeed in the PAC12. Let's see how long USC keeps paying his YUGE salary when he can't be in the top three in the Big Ten. Fuck em. CAL will go 11-1 and end up in the Playoffs.
It’s. About. The. Money
I don't think the move is about football success. it's about the money.
Fully agree. But when they start losing and can't recruit as well, how are the rich alums going to feel then?
UCLA is going to get a huge recruiting boost from this up front. Like, there goes every recruiting battle we might have with them at least in the near term. I'm not as quick to assume they get pounded. Look at how Texas A&M improved in the SEC. (Bad/unique example perhaps.) But outside of Ohio State, the b1g isnt exactly full of juggernauts, and that ground and pound stereotype is mostly a thing of the past outside of Iowa and maybe Wisconsin. And Pac10/12 teams have historically held their own against the B1G pretty well when they play.